Benches...

[Paul Loatman]

Great looking Jig borer, Whiskeybelly!

How big is it? It looks pretty small.

[whiskeybelly]

Great looking Jig borer, Whiskeybelly!

How big is it? It looks pretty small.

Physical size is about 20"x20", the travels are 100mm x/y. It uses B-8 collets; the scope slides out and quill slides in its place for work. The feedscrews are 1mm pitch and have cam correction on the dials and there's an accessory table with a precision scale made of Invar that's used to check or correct the cams.

It's a cute little thing, and the fact that the table can be moved at an angle is very handy for putting in holes for winding stems. Larger machines are, in my opinion, nicer to use; but when I was tooling up and needed a jig borer I didn't have the space for a 1 ton machine. I can just lift this one up onto a bench alone- the Hauser is the same size but the castings are much heavier and I usually just take it apart when I need to move it.

[Paul Loatman]

Great looking Jig borer, Whiskeybelly!

How big is it? It looks pretty small.

Physical size is about 20"x20", the travels are 100mm x/y. It uses B-8 collets; the scope slides out and quill slides in its place for work. The feedscrews are 1mm pitch and have cam correction on the dials and there's an accessory table with a precision scale made of Invar that's used to check or correct the cams.

It's a cute little thing, and the fact that the table can be moved at an angle is very handy for putting in holes for winding stems. Larger machines are, in my opinion, nicer to use; but when I was tooling up and needed a jig borer I didn't have the space for a 1 ton machine. I can just lift this one up onto a bench alone- the Hauser is the same size but the castings are much heavier and I usually just take it apart when I need to move it.

That's actually smaller than i thought. How much do these go for nowadays if you can manage to find one? I was looking into jig borers, but i can get inexpensive mini cnc mills for less than most jig borers, plus most of the jig borers i find for sale are huge.

[whiskeybelly]

Paul, finding them is the trick! The Dixi is much more rare than the Hauser M1. M1s go for anywhere from 3000 to 20,000, depending on how complete it is, if it has been rebuilt, DRO, etc. Generally when they crop up in usuable shape they run around 6-7000 dollars. There are a lot of these out there with only scopes and no quills, as they were used as toolmaker's microscopes for inspection.

With a good CNC you can eliminate much of the need for a jig borer. But I'm pretty old fashioned and luckily there is work out there that pays me to use these old machines. I'm one of the few people I know of who doesn't have a high precision DRO on his jig borer and I use it frequently. I like to use the excuse that I don't want to drill mounting holes into my pristine Dixi .

There are other small jig borers out there, notably from Sadamel and Leitz. Both are more substantial machines than the Hauser/Dixi, but reasonably small and moveable by two people. The Sadamel has a similar scope/quill arrangement to the Hauser/Dixi, but the Leitz is unique in that the scope is internal to the quill, and uses 8mm collets that are tightened by a nose piece at the business end of the quill.

Here's a Leitz:



and a Sadamel:



(pics courtesy of the interwebs)

[Paul Loatman]

Wow, they can get pretty expensive. Taig makes a mini cnc mill for less than 3k. It's not super accurate but definitely more accurate than a normal mill, i may go with the Taig just for convenience sake.

For now i'm stuck being really traditional with just my Webster Whitcomb lathe. Use it for drilling, milling, and normal lathe stuff. I need to learn to do it the hard way first.

[Ophiuchus]

Paul, I have one of those Taig mills- a practically brand new manual model with a Sherline rotary table, and no CNC in sight. That's all I have. I don't even have a lathe, but I suppose I could make a lathe with this.

I personally attest to the build quality- they are very solid, rugged, and quite precise machines. I bought it with total intention of using it to make watches and watch parts, as well as custom tools and well, anything I please. I own many hand tools, but this mill is the one serious piece of equipment I own, and I don't get much time to use it (I move around a lot lately)

Until I get an affordable copy of Watchmaking by Daniels, the mill will make simple things. I highly recommend the Taig, though- I researched small mills for years before settling on the Taig. For around 900$, you can get a full travel X axis model like mine- see Carter Tools. If you add a linear encoder to a mill, you can get an even higher positional accuracy for watchmaking than dials alone will give.

I leave you with 2 pictures of Thomas Prescher's workbenches/shop I found, the only ones I've ever seen of his shop. http://bayimg.com/eAkJCaACB http://bayimg.com/EakJEaACb

[Jacob Sobell]

The Dixi looks fantastic! AND you have a Hauser M1? I have been looking at getting a small jig borer for my shop as my next major purchase.

Here is my "baby"...

[whiskeybelly]

The Dixi looks fantastic! AND you have a Hauser M1? I have been looking at getting a small jig borer for my shop as my next major purchase.

You'll have a lot more luck finding a Hauser 2BA or similar machine than an M1. They are better in many ways- more headroom under the spindle, stable, and you don't have to stand up and reach behind the machine every time you want to move the y axis. The only drawback is the size and weight.

Long before I had a jig borer I had a similar precision drill press to your Levin. I used a micrometric x/y slide that I think came from the optics industry; didn't have the benefit of a scope in the spindle to line things up but it did allow placing holes with relative accuracy.

Do you have the quill holder for your Schaublin 70 milling attachment? You can do jig boring work with that quite accurately (used to do it on a 102 myself). If you don't have it, it's worth finding as you can interchange a beautiful Gepy quill with an Isoma scope in it. The only bear is that if you are using the scope for locating work, and then changing to the quill, the whole slide/milling attachment have to be perfectly aligned to the headstock or you will have some nasty surprises with your holes being off location. Takes some time with an indicator and pencil and pad with lots of gentle nudging... with a mallet .

[Jacob Sobell]

I have been looking at getting a Gepy quill as I do have the quill holder and Marcel Aubert centering scope. I also have the standard milling attachment. It would seem I should have gotten the quill instead as it appears to be more user friendly but I could be very wrong here as I have not use one yet.
Would you recommend at new Gepy quill or are good used ones available?

If the cross slide is aligned with the head stock and the vertical slide/mill is flush and tight with the cross slide, there may still be considerable misalignment? I suppose I will have to play with it myself to see how much of a nuisance it is. M1's seem to be far more available than that Dixi you have. The accessories are maybe harder to find. I like the size of the M1. I think a bigger machine will take up more room than I have to spare and the weight becomes a major concern as I am on the second floor!

[Curtis]

Hi Jacob,

Thanks for the pic of your workshop. It is nicely equipped and very tidy. Any watchmaker would be pleased to work in such an environment.

Cheers,

Curtis

[Curtis]

Hi all,

Watchmaker extraordinaire, Andreas Strehler, sent me the following stop motion video he made in 2001. He thought it was long lost, but it emerged from the depths of his computer recently.

He has a new workshop now, a few grey hairs, and is still as clever as ever...

The photo below was taken the same year as the stop motion video was made.



Click to view the video and, while you're at it, have a look at Andreas' website.

*I was unable to view it using Firefox, but Safari worked... try different browsers if you are having trouble viewing it.

Cheers,

Curtis

[Paul Loatman]

Paul, I have one of those Taig mills- a practically brand new manual model with a Sherline rotary table, and no CNC in sight. That's all I have. I don't even have a lathe, but I suppose I could make a lathe with this.

I personally attest to the build quality- they are very solid, rugged, and quite precise machines. I bought it with total intention of using it to make watches and watch parts, as well as custom tools and well, anything I please. I own many hand tools, but this mill is the one serious piece of equipment I own, and I don't get much time to use it (I move around a lot lately)

Until I get an affordable copy of Watchmaking by Daniels, the mill will make simple things. I highly recommend the Taig, though- I researched small mills for years before settling on the Taig. For around 900$, you can get a full travel X axis model like mine- see Carter Tools. If you add a linear encoder to a mill, you can get an even higher positional accuracy for watchmaking than dials alone will give.

I leave you with 2 pictures of Thomas Prescher's workbenches/shop I found, the only ones I've ever seen of his shop. http://bayimg.com/eAkJCaACB http://bayimg.com/EakJEaACb

Well it's good to get a second opinion, i may go with the setup you suggest as well if it's that much less. You can pre-order Watchmaking by Daniels for about $54 right now, which is a pretty good price compared to all the used ones out there. They're supposed to ship May 25th, but i'm not so sure about that date, i've had it pre-ordered for close to 7 months and before they said it would ship sometime in December.

Those picutures of Prescher's shop aren't working for me, but i'm currently using a WIFI service at the Sacramento Amtrak station so it may just be my connection.

Also Jacob,

That's a very nice set up you have there, i wish i had a Schaublin lathe like that.

[Jacob Sobell]

I have worked hard to set up and maintain my shop in a professional manner. I always regret when I take a short cut as I always end up doing it over. Thus cheap tools tend to cost me more than good tools. I cannot stand working amongst clutter at it distracts my mind from the task at hand. The shop is not finished but it is a work in progress.

Here is a picture of my other shop...







Also a recent video...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fIOuwT_Q6LM




.

[Hajme Asaoka]

milling machine with MITUTOYO DRO


myford lathe


milling machine with SONY DRO


MITUTOYO Optical comparator


watch lathe


dial printer


My Portrait

[whiskeybelly]

Fantastic Hajme! Who made the mill in the first pic? Looks very well built. I always enjoy seeing machines with chips on them- and I notice what looks like a Swiss PB screwdriver in the Myford chip pan .